Why do harp players have such bad reputations

Hi everyone, I’ve been reading a lot of late about harmonica players now mostly this is Blues and some rock players, why do they have such bad reputations? Not as musicians but as people? And another thing that struck me a lot of harp players of the past had real serious health problems and addictions not to mention being very quick to lose their tempers and get into fights and in some cases get seriously killed! Now I have a habit when reading of mentioning these things to my wife, she is now giving me these sideways glances worried that something bad will happen to me? Either that or she’s wondering if my insurance is all paid up. Just wondering what’s your take on this? Do we have any secret bad boys bad girls here? I might st admit to having a serious addiction to Liquorice all sorts :joy::joy::joy::joy:

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I used to have a very bad reputation within in the harmonica community. For many years, seemed like everybody made fun of me because I loved Terry McMillan and happened to be autistic. These people, mostly older white men, thought that there was something wrong with me, that I needed to be “fixed”, or that I’m being very manipulative when I’m not. I may sometimes come across as a distant and cold hearted loner, but I realized it wasn’t me who was causing all of these problems, but some of the people around me. I’ve been traumatized by these people for so long that I thought for years that I would never be a good player or sound like my heroes. Some of the trauma still affects me a lot as a player, but I’m trying to recover from it.
There are a lot of men in the community who act like they should be the boss of me and try to tell me what to play or what should I do with my personal life. One person told me that calling the elitist players, “elitist”, made me obsessed with them and that because I wasn’t threatened with violence, that the bullying I received wasn’t valid. Recently, when I tried to call out George Miklas for his toxic behavior on Facebook, my comment got removed because it was “off-topic”. The higher-ups in the harmonica world just want me to be a submissive mouse who obeys everything what they’re told to do. I want to be more than that, but when I stand up for myself, I get told that I’m toxic and I should “act more mature for my age”. This is not just on Facebook, but on Harp-L too.

I’m autistic too, Asperger’s high functioning and I never let anyone push me around. We all have our heroes that we wish to emulate or even get near. I’m an older White male but nearly all my heroes are dead black guys!?
The fact is we all need to start somewhere and that is usually by listening to our favorite players. A lot of people tend to run the blues down as “simplistic” but I’ve yet to hear any of those guys play it with the feeling or the soul like it’s supposed to be. I don’t claim to be expert on anything but I’m good at what I do know. I play regularly in front of audiences in order to try things out and get things right. But I would never let anyone tell me how to play luckily I have people I get feed back off. I was once like you a loner, but then I met my wife, she understands me and sometimes she has to explain to people why I sometimes act the way I do, I’m very black and white in my thinking and very literal, I don’t always get jokes, and I have my quiet withdrawn moments too and my angry moments. But the people that have taken the time and had patience with me are now friends with me and respect me for my playing. It is hard for years I was on my own. My wife when she met me said that I just looked so sad and alone but I had lovely qualities. It was those qualities that drew us together. I’m sure eventually when people hear you play and you play the way you want to ( be you!) you will draw people to you at first it might feel disconcerting but trust me go with it. I wish you all the best my friend.

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Being slightly tongue in cheek to OP, I think it’s probably not so different from the stories of many a blues and rock musician and I’d say it’s not the harmonica who made them that way but hanging around with musicians :wink:

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Trumpet players used to have this same issue. Johnny Cash had a trumpet in his bad and the grand Ole Opry would not let him play initially. After he was so popular the character specialists had a change of heart, Frankly if someone is this judgmental I could care less what they think as people I have no respect for them or their opinion. After about five years of practice and dedication you may hear this from a guy because the ladies seem to like to hear nice music, including the one the jerk is with.

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Oh yeah, I have a very pretty wife, and I have received comments there are a lot of jealous people in the world

Not very nice? Growing up in the segregated south in the early to mid-1900’s, issues of family economics, systemic racism, school/ literacy, and dealing with unscrupulous people and others of questionable integrity – record company execs, club owners, music publishing rights, songwriting credits, taxes, etc. it set the stage for anyone to not be very nice, not just harmonica players.

I can speak to some of the better known and older guys, the first two based on a long friendship with their frequent guitar player, Luther Tucker.

Rice Miller/Sonny Boy Williamson II was pretty ornery in later years, but considering growing up in the south (see paragraph 1) in the early 1900’s, he had a right. In fairness, he proved his likability based on his popularity as a performer and radio personality (KFFA), and he was accommodating to two very young harmonica players, Junior Wells and James Cotton, housing and teaching them.

He may have been less than gracious to the blues rockers who wanted to play with him (Yardbirds, etc). Also, as Tucker said, “He played with a pint of whiskey under his foot and had another under his pillow when he went to sleep.” He could be fun but was a little rough and tumble.

Little Walter was scrappy, had a temper, and got in a lot of fights, often because he had a way with women that their boyfriends and husbands didn’t appreciate. Alcohol exacerbated problems, affected his playing, and shortened his life.

Junior Wells was very wary until he trusted you. He’d been messed with (business, relationships, etc). He was tough, funny, smart, and nice to me. Cotton was fun, knowledgeable, approachable, and very kind. Both were popular with the ladies. Guess they weren’t too bad.

Other people along the way – Big Walter Horton, Earring George Mayweather, Little Willie Anderson, Jimmy Reed. Everyone has quirks. Some people have substance abuse issues. I can only say that as a young, white music journalist and harmonica player, all of these guys were kind and gracious in their own unique ways.

Egos larger than abilities? Is this about harmonica players . . . or guitarists?

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You also had Paul Delay who was massively talented but did time for coke dealing and died early, William Clarke died early although what I’ve heard about him he seemed to be a driven but very nice guy. Was Little Walter that was killed in a card game? And Sonny Boy the First was Killed over a dice game with an Ice Pick?
Rick Estrin although a nice guy now freely admits he was not a very nice guy when he was young. So not just the Black guys some of the more modern players seem to have had their problems, Paul Butterfield had drug problems Alan Blind Owl Wilson ( who was possibly autistic from what I’ve read, as he had many of the traits I have. If not for my wife I doubt I’d have made it) had drug problems too. From what I’ve read a lot of guys either go completely off the rails or die early. It’s only been recently that they’ve started to clean up.

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Don’t get me started with guitarists with egos, had one of those recently. Don’t understand that either, I think my autism though it may weigh me down sometimes protects me from all that ego driven crap. Autism make you feel as if your never quite good enough. We are very fragile when it comes to that. Again if not for my wife I’d have a lot of problems dealing she’s very fierce and protective of me as well a stunningly beautiful. I’m a very lucky man.

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I met Junior Wells and James Cotton too, Also met Tucker too

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Are harp players generally looked down on by other musicians? If so is it because harps are seen as cheap ‘toys’ given to kids or possibly because other musicians often get to experience bad harp players wanting to sit in? This weekend I’ve had a great time, racing historic cars in the wet (I love wet conditions:) and had a great jam session with friends, A couple of guys none of us knew said they’d been watching the racing and asked to sit in; one had bongos and the other pulled out a harp; they were both dreadful :sob: :scream:. Neither could play properly or keep time and the guy with the harp only had one and tried to play without any idea of key, timing or when to stop, he didn’t even know what my chromatic was when he saw it! We just said ‘thanks guys’ and they went off happy. Should we have told them to learn how to play before sitting-in? We just wanted to get on without causing a ‘situation’ but did we do them a disservice? Did we do other musicians a disservice? I did suggest the Harmonica Forum to the guy with a harp, something he said he’d not heard of. Personally I like all my teeth in place and my nose in its present shape but should we risk offending people by telling them they need to learn and improve before asking to sit in?

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I’ve seen guys who have all the techniques down but played like robots, no emotion, I mean really how can you teach that? Just waiting for my wife to get ready so we can wander into York

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These guys are probably the same people who think that 100% pure tongue blocking is the way to get most expression on the harmonica, which I have dealt with in the past.

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Yes, indeed, they play all the notes but there’s no soul there

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Yeap Its probably that great harp players wind up with their ex girl friend.

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The reason is that most harmonica players don’t seek musical training, don’t learn to read or discuss music, and don’t learn songs or hear changes. In other words, it is earned.

Ever notice how nobody disrespects a violin player? It is because they train.

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There’s one guy who’s trying to make the instrument more prominent in American colleges, but he was very abusive towards me. I don’t want to speak his name because even mentioning his name will give me flashbacks to the many emails and comments he sent to me of him gaslighting me. I’m tired of these people in power who are percived as nice but turn out to be terrible human beings.

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These people are put here so you become proficient at ignoring jerks. He will probably never figure out his talk makes him look a whole lot worse than anything he can say about you. I would just look at him, shake my head, and say I am very glad I am not you with a smile. He most likely will disappear for good.

This is not the desired result he was expecting, especially if people close by laugh at your comment at his expense.

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My grandad used to say the more you ignore a bully or an attention seeking idiot the more they dislike it eventually they’ll go an find an easier target to pick on.

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I have a policy of disregarding mean things people say and proceeding in the direction the conversation was going to go.

About 90% of the time they just buckle up for the ride. But if I dig in about what they said, it’s always a conflict. Usually that happens when I feel defensive because of an insecurity.

Then there’s the 10% where people are having a bad day, or showcasing challenging personalities.

This philosophy has allowed me to get the best from challenging people.

Heck I’m doing it today after a conversation with my mom :stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes:

It’s not always easy but it helps me get along.

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